Although I have completed the required hours for clinic, I honestly do not wish that upon anyone. If the school can relax its requirements, I know that all students from here on out, whether full-time or part-time, will be less stressed and have more time to focus on the most important aspect of law school, passing the bar. If the ABA has it's requirements, then our school should not create requirements that go so far above and beyond those requirements. If the school can allow students to get paid for externships, then it should. Student debt, including my own, is a huge stress, therefore to have had that option would have been great. This should NOT be about, "well I had to do it, therefore so should you". It should be about the future success of OUR law school and making sure the requirements are created fairly for that particular program. While this petition seems tailored to just the part-time students, I can clearly see the benefit it would have for full-time students who come after me.
D
David Twu
9 years ago
As Maslanka would say, this may be outside of the zip code, but it would benefit us all to remember that we should be grateful to be in the positions we find ourselves in. Our challenges are unique to each other and none is greater than our peers. I encourage everyone to listen to the Freakonmics Podcast about Tailwind Headwind Assymetry as it attempts to answer the bias when people ask "why is my life so much harder?" Enjoy and go UNT!
http://freakonomics.com/podcast/why-is-my-life-so-hard/
A
Amber Prange
· petition starter
9 years ago
I've already had this discussion with Pryor and Haseltine, and was told the two practicums would not satisfy this. You can do two clinics or two externships, but two practicums is not applicable. We are asking that it become acceptable, hence this petition to receive clarification and approval.
L
Lanna Hoskins
9 years ago
The 2015 entering requirements state: "Completion of at least two courses from any of the following three categories: Practicum, Externship, and Clinic. Subject to approval, two courses can be from the same category." I can do two Practiums but the Clinic hours are too excessive. Currently I take vacation days just to do the CEP because I want the experience rather than just legal research on the weekends. I am not asking for exceptions, rather accommodations.
L
Louie Tijerina
9 years ago
I agree.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
...oh, and btw, something tells me you would really like Amber Prange!
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Who are you? The ghost of Kim Jong Il?
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Just curious, but whatever happened to the blue dress? Did the government keep that as evidence? Does Monica have it? Did Ken Starr get to keep it? Is it hanging in a closet down in Waco somewhere eminating the essence of your mojo? Maybe that explains what's going on at Baylor these days.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
I think SMU and TAMU did away with their programs for economic reasons...some of which probably had to do with our arrival. You know, working adults could pay 48K or 13K annually for the same degree. Kinda a no brainer. Just for the record, if I were a traditional full-time day student with no children and no job, a 4.0 would be a freaking breeze. For real!
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Greg...you shouldn't be so hateful. Karma has a way of biting you in the keister. Who knows you could be out for a run and a tree branch drop on your head. Live and let live.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
I had a dream last night. It involved Mia Khalifa and Ivanka Trump.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Privetstvuyu vas, drug SSHA. Spasibo za vashu pomoshch' v izbranii Donal'da.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Kim...what happened to your rocket today? Sounds like you got a premature detenation problem.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
Steve...everybody knows Steve Wozniak did all the real work.
J
Jonathon Storment
9 years ago
C'mon Donald...I voted for you twice.
R
Rebeca Guzman
9 years ago
I agree with the messaging.
I am disappointed there are comments on here that express the incorrect notion that evening students feel entitled. That is completely incorrect, and I challenge those individuals who feel that way to come and talk to ANY evening student about our "entitlement" and see if he or she is able to maintain that attitude moving forward.
C
Christina Hill
9 years ago
I am in full support of the petition
R
Rosalyn Khalil
9 years ago
It is difficult for me to get in my community hours. I work full-time, I am in the military, and I have 3 children. Finding time for my job, school, and children are hard enough. Just doing the homework and research and writing projects are time consuming. Nevertheless, I am committed to seeing this through!
I applaud the UNTDallasCOL for allowing students to participate in community engagement. However, to make it a requirement for students who are trying to focus on our studies (GPAs) and possibly leave our current jobs to practice law in the future, it becomes difficult to remain competitive in law school. Also, I work from 8:30am until 6:00pm and class starts at 6:15pm. I cannot take off work to participate in Community Engagement activities or even meet with others in my group during the week. I have NEVER been able to meet my CEP hours since my first semester. I'm worried that I won't graduate on time because of this requirement. Please consider altering or eliminating the requirement. Thank you.
M
Melanie Finch
9 years ago
(1) I have learned so much from the clinic and my externship, but I will need two semesters to complete each, and the time commitment cuts into my school, and work schedule. I was embarrassed to tell my externship sponsor that I will need to continue into another semester, because it feels like a failure on my part that I could not cram in 168 hours into one semester, on top of my full time job, and school. That would have been impossible. (2) It is unreasonable to hold class time for the externship and clinic before 6pm and expect evening students to participate. It makes me feel like the part-time students are an not considered in the planning. (3) We are only allowed to work at non-profits for externship credit. My externship has been a valuable experience. But the non-profit requirement prevents me from using this as an opportunity to blend the externship with my current career. I have great ideas and opportunities to do other externships if the process is expanded to allow for-profits .
N
Ngoc Diep Nguyen
9 years ago
I concur. Part-time evening students are different from Full-time day students. I know of one faculty member who believes that part-time students should get "no special privileges" over the day students and that what is required of them [full-time] should be required of us [part-time]. I differ from this faculty member and all for this petition.
Debi Nguyen, MPAS, PA-C
Although I have completed the required hours for clinic, I honestly do not wish that upon anyone. If the school can relax its requirements, I know that all students from here on out, whether full-time or part-time, will be less stressed and have more time to focus on the most important aspect of law school, passing the bar. If the ABA has it's requirements, then our school should not create requirements that go so far above and beyond those requirements. If the school can allow students to get paid for externships, then it should. Student debt, including my own, is a huge stress, therefore to have had that option would have been great. This should NOT be about, "well I had to do it, therefore so should you". It should be about the future success of OUR law school and making sure the requirements are created fairly for that particular program. While this petition seems tailored to just the part-time students, I can clearly see the benefit it would have for full-time students who come after me.
As Maslanka would say, this may be outside of the zip code, but it would benefit us all to remember that we should be grateful to be in the positions we find ourselves in. Our challenges are unique to each other and none is greater than our peers. I encourage everyone to listen to the Freakonmics Podcast about Tailwind Headwind Assymetry as it attempts to answer the bias when people ask "why is my life so much harder?" Enjoy and go UNT! http://freakonomics.com/podcast/why-is-my-life-so-hard/
I've already had this discussion with Pryor and Haseltine, and was told the two practicums would not satisfy this. You can do two clinics or two externships, but two practicums is not applicable. We are asking that it become acceptable, hence this petition to receive clarification and approval.
The 2015 entering requirements state: "Completion of at least two courses from any of the following three categories: Practicum, Externship, and Clinic. Subject to approval, two courses can be from the same category." I can do two Practiums but the Clinic hours are too excessive. Currently I take vacation days just to do the CEP because I want the experience rather than just legal research on the weekends. I am not asking for exceptions, rather accommodations.
I agree.
...oh, and btw, something tells me you would really like Amber Prange!
Who are you? The ghost of Kim Jong Il?
Just curious, but whatever happened to the blue dress? Did the government keep that as evidence? Does Monica have it? Did Ken Starr get to keep it? Is it hanging in a closet down in Waco somewhere eminating the essence of your mojo? Maybe that explains what's going on at Baylor these days.
I think SMU and TAMU did away with their programs for economic reasons...some of which probably had to do with our arrival. You know, working adults could pay 48K or 13K annually for the same degree. Kinda a no brainer. Just for the record, if I were a traditional full-time day student with no children and no job, a 4.0 would be a freaking breeze. For real!
Greg...you shouldn't be so hateful. Karma has a way of biting you in the keister. Who knows you could be out for a run and a tree branch drop on your head. Live and let live.
I had a dream last night. It involved Mia Khalifa and Ivanka Trump.
Privetstvuyu vas, drug SSHA. Spasibo za vashu pomoshch' v izbranii Donal'da.
Kim...what happened to your rocket today? Sounds like you got a premature detenation problem.
Steve...everybody knows Steve Wozniak did all the real work.
C'mon Donald...I voted for you twice.
I agree with the messaging. I am disappointed there are comments on here that express the incorrect notion that evening students feel entitled. That is completely incorrect, and I challenge those individuals who feel that way to come and talk to ANY evening student about our "entitlement" and see if he or she is able to maintain that attitude moving forward.
I am in full support of the petition
It is difficult for me to get in my community hours. I work full-time, I am in the military, and I have 3 children. Finding time for my job, school, and children are hard enough. Just doing the homework and research and writing projects are time consuming. Nevertheless, I am committed to seeing this through! I applaud the UNTDallasCOL for allowing students to participate in community engagement. However, to make it a requirement for students who are trying to focus on our studies (GPAs) and possibly leave our current jobs to practice law in the future, it becomes difficult to remain competitive in law school. Also, I work from 8:30am until 6:00pm and class starts at 6:15pm. I cannot take off work to participate in Community Engagement activities or even meet with others in my group during the week. I have NEVER been able to meet my CEP hours since my first semester. I'm worried that I won't graduate on time because of this requirement. Please consider altering or eliminating the requirement. Thank you.
(1) I have learned so much from the clinic and my externship, but I will need two semesters to complete each, and the time commitment cuts into my school, and work schedule. I was embarrassed to tell my externship sponsor that I will need to continue into another semester, because it feels like a failure on my part that I could not cram in 168 hours into one semester, on top of my full time job, and school. That would have been impossible. (2) It is unreasonable to hold class time for the externship and clinic before 6pm and expect evening students to participate. It makes me feel like the part-time students are an not considered in the planning. (3) We are only allowed to work at non-profits for externship credit. My externship has been a valuable experience. But the non-profit requirement prevents me from using this as an opportunity to blend the externship with my current career. I have great ideas and opportunities to do other externships if the process is expanded to allow for-profits .
I concur. Part-time evening students are different from Full-time day students. I know of one faculty member who believes that part-time students should get "no special privileges" over the day students and that what is required of them [full-time] should be required of us [part-time]. I differ from this faculty member and all for this petition. Debi Nguyen, MPAS, PA-C