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Name: Glenn C. Rector on Jan 12, 2011Comments: This comment was deleted on 2011-12-29 10:44:39Flag
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Name: Robert Nugent on Jan 20, 2011Comments: I have been working for the Department of The Army for six years now. Now, they tell me for the first time, that I have to take the PAT to keep my job. I didn't have to do it all this time, like back when I was writing tickets, and making apprehensions, and doing POLICE WORK as a 0085 Security Guard. And, why is it that I passed the PAT for Sergeant, but the powers that be gave the job to someone that didn't pass the test. Please, someone, somewhere, investigate the hiring and promotion pratices at Ft. Knox. I am tired of this good ole boy crap!Flag
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Name: Lawrence Baptista on Feb 2, 2011Comments: considering the work we do I agree there should be a standard for physical fitness for all employees however the standards that have been and are now in effect are poorly suited for several reasons age being the most obvious but it is extremely unfair that Army Fed Fire or any other jobs requiring physical fittness not be required to pass a PAT. Firemen work conditions require more physical fitness and lung strength, a DPW worker may be required to lift items in excess of 100lbs without hurting themselves yet there are no mandatory PAT's for these people, well at least where im from (Hawaii).Flag
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Name: Nola Templemire on Feb 17, 2011Comments: Apparently the Department of The Navy is going to this as well. We are told that we can not hire any one unless they are a 30% or more disabled vet yet they are instituting physical fitness requirements that a lot of DAVs can not pass. Frankly I am at a loss to understand these contradictory policies. Nor do I understand the lack of a grandfather provision, this is not how you treat people. It is disrespectful and dishonest.Flag
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Name: Bighouse on Mar 19, 2011Comments: Looking at getting hired at Ft Benning, didnt know about the PT test. Rated 80% disabled by VA from injuries incurred during jump status and OIF I. Recently graduated with teaching degree and certification but cannot find work. Dont tell me I still cant find work because I cant run like I did 10 years ago! Most veterans and retirees do not do that level of physical conditioning when they are discharged or retire. How do you tell a retired E7, E8, or E9 that they cannot work because they are not in the same condition as they were 10.15. 20 years ago. I agree with you all, why specially request a disabled veteran when you are not willing to make special provisions for that individual. The job requires attention to detail, courtesies, and being able to follow procedure. Please do not get rid of all this wealth of experience because of some misguided thinking. As long as the guard can perform the job and not look sloppy in uniform let that shit ride and treat our veterans the way they deserve to be treated. Look at the stats: 308 million Americans in the US, 2 million locked-up, 1.4 million in armed services. What the hell is the rest of 305.6 million doing for their country? We sare the ones who volunteered (or drafted) and made that sacrifice for service. Now its time to return a rightfully earned favor!Flag
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Name: Joe Moran on Mar 23, 2011Comments: Perhaps a New PT test should be created strictly for Police and Security Guards that is not as demanding as the active duty Army PT test. Some testing is warranted based on comparision to State and Local law enforcement officers who are required to take test annually.Flag
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Name: Stanley Laird on Apr 2, 2011Comments: This test is unfair. I have over twenty years working for DOD Police and then they change the rules on me. This is unethical.Flag
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Name: Audrey Harris, President, Local 738, Ft. Leavenworth, KS on Apr 21, 2011Comments: Read this pertaining to 190-56. 5 C.F.R. 339.204 Waiver of standards and requirements. Agencies must waive a medical standard or physical requirement established under this part when these is sufficient evidence that an applicant or employee, with or without reasonable accommodation, can perform the essential duties of the position without endangering the health and safety of the individual or others. This information was passed on to us by the James , President Local 1708.Flag
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Name: Audrey Harris, President, Local 738, Ft. Leavenworth, KS on Apr 21, 2011Comments: Read this pertaining to 190-56. 5 C.F.R. 339.204 Waiver of standards and requirements. Agencies must waive a medical standard or physical requirement established under this part when these is sufficient evidence that an applicant or employee, with or without reasonable accommodation, can perform the essential duties of the position without endangering the health and safety of the individual or others. This information was passed on to us by the James , President Local 1708.Flag
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Name: James Schultz on Apr 23, 2011Comments: The USAF is trying to do the same thing to us. Any help you can give me would be appreciated.Flag
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Name: Antonio Nunez on Apr 25, 2011Comments:Flag
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Name: Wheeler M. Stephens, Sr. on Jun 17, 2011Comments: I strongely agree with this issue and I feel that civilian senior men and women in uniform services should not be subjected to this type of irony to maintain their life style. Not only does it put people such as myself out of work but it also take away our health insurance, up to to include dental and vision insurance. So, please stop this irony and let us live a digified life. Besides, some of us have put a lot on the line for many years for this country, our families, your families. Now, think of this; I hear it so many times that, "you volunteered" yes I did, but think about this, what would America be like now if myself and many other American did not volunteered.Flag
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Name: Tammy Kennedy on Jun 26, 2011Comments: I think that if you have been employed at a federal institution and you have done the same PT for 7 or 8 years and all of the sudden you have to do an entirely different PT and they are cutting your time also , Yes I think that is wrong . You have people that have been doing this job for years and have always satisified management with the job , then they change everything basically to weed out the older ones it seems , well you have alot more accidents and errors because the new people that can do this PT in 4 min. are having problems. I think if it changes from what you hired in doing , I think they should be grandfathered in.Flag
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Name: Michael V. Owens on Jun 27, 2011Comments:Flag
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Name: Michael V. Owens on Jun 27, 2011Comments:Flag
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Name: George LaPenta on Jul 7, 2011Comments: Really...at 52 y/o with a service connected disability, I'm expected to do a PT test. Not too mention I was advised today that my test is Monday. Three days away. PLEASE!!!Flag
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Name: Paul on Jul 15, 2011Comments: I am retired military and have been in law enforcement in the civilian market for 15 yrs. during my military career I was opposed to the PAT/PRT (which ever you choose to call it) for the reason that what does it prove other than the military and civilian gov covering thier BUTTS under false primise? I have both during my military career and civilian personally witinessed personell that have DIED be it from heart failure or other medical problem's shortly after SUCCESSFUL completion of the PRT/PAT. So, again I ask what good is this other than to say someone was healthy enough on this day?????Flag
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Name: Anonymous on Jul 26, 2011Comments: What is the difference between staying in shape when in the military, and staying in shape in law enforcement. They are both physically demanding jobs that require a level of fitness. If you couldn't pass the PT test in the Army you were out! If you can't pass the PT test in the civilian law enforcment field, then get out! I've spent 21 years in the military. Five of those years were on active duty. I've been a cop for 12 years now, and still in excellent shape. I've sustained numerous injuries in the Rangers, and even been wounded in combat. I've sustained injuries in law enforcement, as well. The difference is I CHOSE to stay in shape because I knew what my job required both physically and mentally! I didn't make an excuse for my fitness level, or decide in my career that I was too old for this s***. Nor did I make excuses for my profession by saying how much fitness does it take to pull the trigger. I'm in CA where gangbangers, drugs, domestics, and other violent crimes are always present. I will always win! Most of that success comes from maintaining a high level of fitness! Bring on the PAT, I'm going to smoke the crap out of it and anxiously await the next one!! Rangers Lead the WayFlag
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Name: S. Velez on Aug 1, 2011Comments: I agree with the above post 100%. I'm in my forties, and understand what is necessary to perform my job. I am fully aware my job is physically demanding. As a young cop many years ago, I complained about the older ones being fat and out of shape. I respected the police service connected cops that were disabled, to a certain degree; but were still able to perform the job. Granted, they were no longer assigned to patrol, but were detectives or administrators and still greatly contributed to the department. I am also retired from the Army. I spent 10 years in the regular army, and the remaining 10 years in the National Guard. I was an admin clerk for 4 years where the APFT was the only standard of measuring record fitness. I chose to go into Special Forces and realized the APFT standard was not enough to measure the actual fitness level of an ODA Operator. In fact, it is weighed as an initial entry standard of fitness. As an SF Weapons Sergeant, I knew I had to have an extremely higher level of fitness. The higher the fitness level, the lesser chance of injury. That's a fact! My point is, law enforcement is the Special Forces specialty in the civilian world. Which entails maintaining a high level of fitness. I have been injured too many times in my military and law enforcement career. Due to a high level of fitness, the injuries were not as severe and I recovered a lot quicker. In other words, if I was a fat or skinny weak kid, the injuries sustained would have been worse or multiplied. Not to mention the increased time for recovery. This is not NEW NEWS to anyone, so don't deny it! I also have a service connected disability from Afghanistan. Instead of using it as an excuse to perform my job and gettingbeers from listening souls, I trained around my disablility and strengthened other areas that would get me back up to standard. No...I can't run as fast, or lift as much as I used to in my 20's and 30's. But I'm damn close! Also, as a Disabled Veteran, if you have a military service connected disability and you applied for law enforcement, but use it as a punch line to get out of the PAT...shame on you! The government owes you for your service that's for sure, but you owe it to yourself to be able to perform the job, as expected, including the PAT. As I went through my law enforcement career, I ensured I never "let myself go" physically. In fact, the young guys look at me and pray they're in as good of shape as I am when they reach my age. So all you old whiners out there listen up! All it takes is one to prove you wrong, and show that military service connected disabled veterans who are in there 40s (50 is right around the corner), currently serving as a Police Officer CAN DO the job and take the forsaken PAT! I am that one! Those that have died after successfully completing it were never in good shape to begin with, or were not properly medically cleared (huge liability)! If you have been around and are extremely knowledgeable in law enforcement, of course your an asset! But be a damn leader and get in shape to set the example for others to follow. Your massive knowledge will only go so far until your wiped clean from the PAT. Law enforcement is an ever changing environment as new procedures to decrease liability and increase survivability take place. You're either in or your out. So stop making excuses for your bum knee, and beer gut and hit the gym or the asphalt. Police techniques, tactics, and procedures will evolve without you, not around you! If you think it does, go work for range control and tell the young NCO's how you use to be in great shape but your war injury took you out of commission. LOL...and you want a badge and gun to enforce laws! Reality check starts now....Flag
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Name: John L. on Nov 7, 2011Comments: The PAT imakes no sense. How many guards are allow to run a mile from the post!! We are hire because we are disable vet, able to do the job ask of us. Now management in the goverment system is using the Pat and anything they can get away with to get rid of as many of the lower GS workers (GS-4/9) while the sit on theirA$$ saving their do nothing jobs!! And this is giving and saving Vets jobs as the "President" said he wanted to do has turn into a BIG Lie! This is what I see and feel!!Flag
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Robert Colwell on Nov 7, 2011
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Name: Luis on Nov 28, 2011Comments: I agree it isn't fair!Flag
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Name: Marcus D. Gomez on Dec 2, 2011Comments: Its sad and ashamed that we have to take a PT that doesn't mean anything pertaining to the knowledge, education and experienced a person has. Officers has plenty of training and shouldn't make it a job requirement for I am in for close to 14 years as a Police Officer and recently converted to security guards doing the same job!Flag
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Name: Erick Lopez on Dec 5, 2011Comments:Flag
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Name: Woody on Dec 13, 2011Comments: Really! Don't you realize that in order for you to affect an arrest, oops, I mean an apprehension, you have to do the PAT test. I remember when it was the old Army standard. Two mile run, push ups and sit ups! On a serous note, get out of the Department of Dumb asses! I left and went DHS, attended FLETC and my agency as well as FLECT does have an initial standard to meet. An annual test is NON-EXISTENT!Flag
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Name: Anonymous on Dec 13, 2011Comments: Really! Don't you realize that in order for you to affect an arrest, oops, I mean an apprehension, you have to do the PAT test. I remember when it was the old Army standard. Two mile run, push ups and sit ups! On a serous note, get out of the Department of Dumb asses! I left and went DHS, attended FLETC and my agency as well as FLECT does have an initial standard to meet. An annual test is NON-EXISTENT!Flag
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Name: Dennis Scholz on Feb 15, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: David K Palmer Sr on Feb 16, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Michael Welch on Feb 16, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Marcus D. Gomez on Feb 20, 2012Comments: I agree that this requirement should be grandfather in so we wont be require to take this especially with veterans having thier job on the line!Flag
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Name: Josh Tate on Mar 4, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Microsoft OEM Software on Mar 8, 2012Comments: USpChQ wow, awesome blog article.Really thank you! Really Cool.Flag
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Name: Discount OEM Software on Mar 9, 2012Comments: tGjPeS Thanks so much for the blog post.Really thank you! Awesome.Flag
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Name: Doris Hobson on Mar 13, 2012Comments: I believe the new Physical Agility Test that we are being forced to complete is discriminatory. First, it was not a condition of employment (neither verbal nor written in the contract) when I was hired. Second, I am 64 year old female (65 in August) and am expected to physically perform at the same level as a 21 year old male. Third, I have suffered from heat exhaustion while working on post, yet they expect me to attempt this physical test in the month of June when the temperatures are commonly over 100 degrees. I have worked for the Department of the Navy as Security guard since October 2003. The proposed PAT is discriminatory and demoralizing to those who have been doing their jobs for years. We have executed our job duties with the highest standards through all the previous years, so why are we now subjected to a new agility test with the threat of losing our jobs. I believe that as civilian's already working for the Navy, we should be grandfathered in and not be subjected to the threat of losing our jobs.Flag
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Name: Kurtis Mitchell on Mar 13, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: John on Mar 14, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Benjamin Brockwell on Mar 16, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Leeland White on Mar 19, 2012Comments: Please note that security guards are restricted to disabled veterans 5 USC 3310. In addition 5 USC 3312 states that all preference eligible veterans age requirements and physical requirements are waived; and the agency must acquire a doctors certificate establishing that the veteran can efficiently perform the job, not run them off the physical fitness field!. Hello out there, a physical fitness test is a prohibited personnel practice; 5 USC 2302(b)(8)and if one is a 30% and over disabled the agency cannot hire any candidate, until a doctor states that the veteran cannot do the job. This regulation now relates to age. The good news is that no preference eligible at any age if able to perform the duties is waived. This is a recent OPM directive, Preference eligible veterans are waived from PAT tests and from being over the age of 37 if they can efficiently perform the duties as determined by a doctor, rather than the RAMBO types. If you have been discriminated on by age - this is a prohibited personnel practice, 5 USC 2302(b)(8) and can demand the office of special counsel to kick the but of the agency discrimating. If you are a 30% and over disabled veteran, you have individual right of action rights to appeal to the Merit systems protection board pursuant to 5 usc 1221(c)(1) on the denial of your preference eligible waiver pursuant to 5 USC § 3312/3363. Further, the agency in addition to a prohibited personnel practice as discussed in length, the agency discriminates against veterans under 5 USC 2302(b)(11)(A) and 2302(b)(11)(B) The PAT is ludicrous, stupid.Flag
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Name: Dennis Keener on Mar 24, 2012Comments: the requirements for this test are totaly unfair to all officers, especialy thoes whom served in the armed forces and received injuries.Flag
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Name: Anonymous on May 10, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: William Sharpe on May 15, 2012Comments: It needs to go ASAP!Flag
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Name: Elizabeth Melton on May 15, 2012Comments: They hire as a preference individuals with a 30% disability or more. I certainly don't know all the statistics but, I am going to assume most of these individuals have back and knee injuries This is blatant discrimination!. I am a term employee with law enforcement background however, I do not have military background. Disabled vets are hired before me as they have served their country, this I agree with. And now I stand by and watch how they refuse to take care of them in the future. With the unemployment rate skyrocketing in this country, how many more vets and non-vets will lose their jobs? What a sham! The government will just have to support us in the long run.Flag
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Name: DE LEON JAIME JR. on May 20, 2012Comments:Flag
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Name: Dennis Scholz on May 20, 2012Comments:Flag