| # | Name | Comments |
|---|
| 451 | Ann Schenking | |
| 452 | Wendy Moeller, AICP | Being the section director for the Cincinnati Section of the Ohio Planning Conference (APA-Ohio), I can personally say that we have been greatly affected in how we provide educational opportunities to our local planners. We would love to offer the APA web conference option but would be required to charge fees to attend given the high cost of the conferences. We will have to charge more for our local conferences and sessions to be able to recover costs for CM credit. |
| 453 | Anonymous | |
| 454 | Gregory Smith | I support required continuing education, but any program that doesn't count graduate courses, all day seminars and other extreemly beneficial, but not necesserially certified, events towards the requirement doesn't work and is unfair to it's members. |
| 455 | Mark Locker, AICP | Thank you for speaking for so many planners who have been ignored by the APA, and AICP. This program was created more as a cottage industry to create unnecessary jobs for the APA/AICP, and as a money maker, not to ensure planners are better educated. This program restricts members from taking courses of interest at a reasonable fee. In turn, it discourages planners from joining the AICP. |
| 456 | Todd Kinskey | First, let me be clear, I strongly support the concept of required continuing education for AICP members. However, given that becoming a member of AICP is a choice, isn't it interesting that practicing planners (ones who often do all the same work as an AICP certified planner) have no requirement for continuing education. I think that if APA really wanted to assure that planners in this country remained current, up-to-date on recent trends, acted ethically, etc., it would require ALL its members to be involved in some type of CM program.
That being said, I was shocked to learn about the specifics of the CM program when it was finally rolled out. I (mistakenly) assumed the hundreds of hours I'm spending on a graduate degree in Public Administration (many of the courses apply directly to the practicing planner) would cover some of the CM requirements. The university I'm attending would be crazy to pursue CM certification because of the cost. So, while I'm spending my hard earned money on a graduate degree (that counts for nothing as far as AICP-CM is concerned), I also have to attend the dumbed-down APA (local, state & national) courses that attract attendees merely because CM credit is required. While interesting, these courses are generally not interactive and rarely go into great detail because the audiences in these courses are so broad. Too much detail overwhelms the novice, too little detail disinterests the knowledgeable planner. Gone are the days when a lengthy, in-depth course can be offered at a reasonable price to the typical, under-paid planning professional.
The current system needs to be revised. |
| 457 | Brian Humphress, AICP | I concur with the majority of those signing this petition. I am a city manager of a small rural town, and I spend about 20% of my time on direct planning-related activities. My APA/AICP dues come from my pocket, not the city's, and any training I get to maintain my AICP status is generally at my expense, too. I strongly support ongoing education and training, but I also have to meet similar requirements from ICMA and the State of Ohio. Ofttimes, much of the ongoing eduction requirements overlap (such as ethics training), but most of the agencies who provide the other training I need do not have AICP certification, in large part due to the fee structure. Additionally, it is much tougher to find training in rural areas in the first place, and anything that adds barriers to the process needs to be eliminated. Lastly, if there is no easy method to cross-recognize training efforts, I will end up spending more time doing training than actually doing the work I was hired for in the first place. This whole structure needs to be simplified and made more accessible if it is truly going to be effective. I have been proud to be a member of AICP for the past thirteen plus years, but I am afraid that if changes aren't made I will probably drop that membership when the certification period comes up. |
| 458 | Kristen M Lowry | The fees for university courses are way to high. |
| 459 | Anonymous | I am in agreement that the AICP must change its Certification Maintenance fees. As a planner working for a local government, I can also attest to focusing training funds on education that offers CM credits for our AICP certified planners. Interesting enough, I initially thought that attending one major APA hosted (3-day) seminar every year for two years running would cover the mandatory 32 credit hours. This has not been the case. The more I read about this program and witness the system, I realize what a nice cash-cow APA created for itself. No wonder APA conferences are now packed.
I value my AICP professional certification. My employer values it and uses it for expert witness testimony. So while they are amenable to paying for continued education, there is a limit to how much they will spend. Likewise, planners that have dedicated themselves to working for government look for these perks as a tradeoff for receiving lower wages than what private sector may offer. There are a lot of planners working for local government that can not afford to pay for these seminars as well as hotel rates. Perhaps APA can offer a government rate (similar to how they offer student rates)?
Recent economic issues don't help the matter, as local governments are looking to reduce their budgets. Guess what goes first? Yep, training!
Anything that can be done to lower those rates is appreciated, or you are going to start seeing a lot of planners lose their certifications. |
| 460 | Nancy Kukay | |
| 461 | Paul Dorothy | If the CM provisions do not change, as a Transportation Planner I will register with ITE's PTP program instead. The AICP is not required by a single one of my clients and the PTP designation is just a good for the odd member of a selection committee that might care about registration. Last year I logged almost 100 hours of CEUs, 0 of them were eligible as CMs. This is pure and simple a predatory profit making scheme by APA that is directly in conflict with the AICP code of ethics. You should be ashamed! |
| 462 | Wendy Sattin | I find it disheartening that this current stream of comments by AICP members is identical to the comments rendered when the first certification rules were circulated. Were the decision makers unable to understand the real life constraints for practioners in the field or was the opportunity to grab some dollars too enticing? I support the idea of withholding AICP dues until the "powers that be" respond in a meaningful way to the thoughtful comments forwarded by the membership they are supposed to represent. |
| 463 | Wendy Sattin | I find it disheartening that this current stream of comments by AICP members is identical to the comments rendered when the first certification rules were circulated. Were the decision makers unable to understand the real life constraints for practioners in the field or was the opportunity to grab some dollars too enticing? I support the idea of withholding AICP dues until the "powers that be" respond in a meaningful way to the thoughtful comments forwarded by the membership they are supposed to represent. |
| 464 | Raymond J. DeCarlo | I am considering taking the test for AICP. The initial cost is high for a relative beginner (MA from the U. of Akron in 2004 and full time employment with the City of Youngstown, OH in 2006) but the cost in time and money for certification maintenance are prohibitive at this point. |
| 465 | Keith Hernandez, AICP | Many relevant and affordable education options are unfairly being excluded from the CE process. With limited training budgets, municipalities are struggling to maintain a "properly certified" staff. The prohibitive costs of having a training session AICP endorsed is punitive to the planner and the trainer. |
| 466 | Brendie Vega Mkhwanazi | While my company is paying for the cost of CM, I don't think it is fair for those who do not have the benefit of someone else paying.
I feel that I am taking a course not because I want to or because it is in an area I work in, but because I am going to get CM's for it. |
| 467 | Terry Schwarz, AICP | |
| 468 | Spencer Hall AICP | APA/AICP's assumption that the cost borne by the providers will be offset by increased enrollment may be erroneous if these responses are any indication. Many are talking of letting their certification lapse and will not take any classes nor attend conferences, thus creating a decrease in the revenue stream. The assumption that having AICP certification garners $5k per year in additional salary is also false, at least in my case. I received no raise nor any promotion as a result of being certified. Despite the fact that the bedroom suburb that I live and wok in has an average household income in excess of $50k our budget is extremely tight because we have no income tax and the citizens do not want one. Any cost associated with CM will therefore have be borne by me and I will have to use vacation time to attend conferences. No income increase coupled with an increase in expenditures. Doesn't sound like much of a deal to me! It does not, therefore, seem logical to me to keep the certification. |
| 469 | Spencer Hall AICP | APA/AICP's assumption that the cost borne by the providers will be offset by increased enrollment may be erroneous if these responses are any indication. Many are talking of letting their certification lapse and will not take any classes nor attend conferences, thus creating a decrease in the revenue stream. The assumption that having AICP certification garners $5k per year in additional salary is also false, at least in my case. I received no raise nor any promotion as a result of being certified. Despite the fact that the bedroom suburb that I live and wok in has an average household income in excess of $50k our budget is extremely tight because we have no income tax and the citizens do not want one. Any cost associated with CM will therefore have be borne by me and I will have to use vacation time to attend conferences. No income increase coupled with an increase in expenditures. Doesn't sound like much of a deal to me! It does not, therefore, seem logical to me to keep the certification. |
| 470 | Ron Miller, FAICP | The restrictions on CM credit qualifications fail to recognize the current breadth and diversity of planning and fails to recognize the importance of promoting even greater breadth and diversity in planning. AICP's CM credit program discourages planners from expanding their knowledge into complementary disciplines and that's detrimental to the profession and to our communities and clients. |
| 471 | Ron Miller, FAICP | The restrictions on CM credit qualifications fail to recognize the current breadth and diversity of planning and fails to recognize the importance of promoting even greater breadth and diversity in planning. AICP's CM credit program discourages planners from expanding their knowledge into complementary disciplines and that's detrimental to the profession and to our communities and clients. |
| 472 | Whitney Finnstrom | Continuing education is critical for planners to keep up with the latest planning techniques and tools (GIS, etc.), but a CM program that is inflexible and expensive is counterproductive. If the end goal is to further the profession by having professionals with strong, up to date skills, then local courses as well as online classes at a nominal cost ($50-$100) should be allowed. |
| 473 | Wayne Wiethe | I have been a member of APA since 1985, and a member of AICP since 1995. The respective Boards of both groups , clearly did not think this out and were simply looking for a revenue stream. Actual practicing planners are not being represented or tbeing brought into the process. |
| 474 | Carol Norton | |
| 475 | Matthew Hansen | Working for a small company, CM credit costs are the most inhibiting factor in maintaining my AICP status. The availability of reasonably priced CM certified classes is essential not only for my own career but for the certified profession as a whole. |
| 476 | John Mataya | |
| 477 | Anonymous | |
| 478 | Andy Dobson, AICP | |
| 479 | Aaron Klibaner | |
| 480 | George McGregor, AICP | I have resigned myself to a mandatory cm program though am not convinced of its utility. Any CM program must be cheap and available--and most important to me--highly interdisciplinary. APA/AICP must act swiftly to make this program easy and accissible for association sponsored and other provider programs.
I have read a lot of threats of leaving apa and aicp. I think they are real. |
| 481 | Thomas Eitler | In particular, the inability for APA/AICP to work out some kind of deal with the Urban Land Institute's Education Program is just pigheaded. APA will claim that they let individual programs involving peakers sponsered by ULI count for credit, but it excludes the huge number of programs from ULI's real estate school. They say the subject matter is not considered not close enough APA "planner" positions to qualify. I suggest that everyone look at the course being taught and decide for themselves. Here is the website: www.uli.org go to education programs / real estate school. I suggest that every planner, public or private should know more about these subjects.
I have been AICP since 1988 and I will be dropping my membership to the entire organization. They put out a pretty magazine, but they have not added much to field of planning. Join ULI |
| 482 | Teri Whitmore, AICP | |
| 483 | Suzann Rhodes, AICP | |
| 484 | Dan Penrose, AICP | |
| 485 | Marie Keister, AICP | The CM process is onerous to sole-proprietor practitioners like me, in cost, time, and inflexibility. I will likely let my AICP and APA membership lapse rather than pursue 32 hours of CM as it is currently structured. |
| 486 | Amy Walbridge, AICP | I support the concept of required continuing education for AICP members. However, I was surprised to learn about the specifics of the Program when it was finally rolled out -- well after the April 14, 2007 vote. Like others, I mistakenly assumed the hours that I invested to improve my skills as a practicing planner would count toward some of the Program requirements. Providers of the recent sessions that I attended (before APA figured out the details of the Program) would be crazy to pursue accreditation because of the cost -- now or in the future. So, while money could be spent attending great sessions (that counts for nothing as far as the CM Program is concerned), I have to instead attend courses that attract attendees because CM credit is offered and where provider have succumbed to paying to play. This current, very flawed system needs to be revised…soon. |
| 487 | Gina D'Agrosa, AICP | |
| 488 | Slade McCalip, AICP | Please include more transportation related training for CM too. |
| 489 | Greg Burnham, AICP | For working planners; require legal and ethics every three years, period. |
| 490 | Bruce Mansfield | |
| 491 | Anonymous | Process needs to be fair to AICP members who are students, work part-time, work in situations where education opportunities are limited or non-existent, retirees, in rural areas, work in non-planning fields, etc. where their ability to access CM courses are not sufficient to maintain their certification. |
| 492 | Alison Imamura, AICP | I agree that the CM requirements are inequitable and unfair based on information I have gathered from a number of respective people in academia and private sector professions. |
| 493 | Patrice Theken | |
| 494 | David Simpson | |
| 495 | Aric Spence | |
| 496 | lbillington@fuquay-varina.org | |
| 497 | Kirby Date | I am working with the Ohio Lake Erie Commission to provide education to planners and elected officials working within local government on best practices for watershed protection. The program provides ceus for landscape architects, surveyors, engineers, attorneys, and real estate professionals. The Commission has found the planners' fees so much higher and the process so much more complex than the other professions that it has considered not providing cms. This is a real potential for next year, and would be a loss for planners.
KD |
| 498 | Anonymous | I plan to try to get as many CM units at the APA conference as possible. Its the only way to make this system work. When you live far from DC and have a limit number of hours for extra-curricula activiites, there is no other way. Even then the number of hours I can take at the conference falls somewhat short of the required 32 hours. There have been several suggestions that point to the fact that there is a better way! |
| 499 | Anonymous | Professional development should not be based on what courses/trainings are approved by APA/AICP. Commonsense dictates professionals to learn/augment knowledge they deem insufficient. All sorts of learning materials are available online and in many other sources. Why limit it only to so-called approve CM courses? Why not only suggest to members who are already paying the memberships the types of courses they should be taking to maintain current with their knowledge? This prescribe CM courses appear to only raise profit. |
| 500 | Anonymous | I support CM for those who have an AICP, however, the program needs to become more equitable for those who aren't as well off as others. Many, if not most, of those who created the CM program work for large organizations and make sizeable salaries. When making the rules, assigning fees/the amount of credits to be given per workshop, etc., they forgot all about those in the planning field who aren't so well off. Planners in small communities or oftentimes those who work for a state government, do not have the luxury of having their employer pay the fees for attending conferences, workshops, coursework, etc. in order to maintain their AICP. And they cannot afford it themselves, yet that is their only option. This is discriminatory. In reading about the costs/fees, it becomes clear, even to those not in the planning field, that the CM program is a money-maker for APA. |